14 Nov 2011 4:49 PM #81
I agree that the performance of ExtJS 4 is not yet acceptable. If I gave you the impression that I think otherwise then I apologize. Sencha have also made it clear on a number of occasions that they see performance as the top priority for the next few releases.
Monkey-patching to solve performance issues is not the ideal solution but it's currently all we have. If you can afford to wait for Sencha to solve these issues then obviously there's no point trying to do it yourself. However, not everyone has the luxury of being able to wait and for those developers who desperately need to improve performance right now so that they can make a release it may be worth a shot at optimizing. There's no guarantees it will work, it's just something to consider. In many cases, like that of stahlman, it will prove fruitless and frustrating.
14 Nov 2011 5:00 PM #82
The "performance baseline" we have right now is 4.1 PR1. So it is a blocker to regress from there. This is currently based on measuring the Themes example and a few others.
Whether or not we will be able to include further improvements in 4.1 is TBD. I wish I could say which way that decision will go, but it is not mine to make.
Our current focus is stabilization, but we do have other promising things we want to do. These are much more isolated than the bulk of the work in 4.1 for rendering and layout, so we are not talking about large-scale efforts here. I will certainly post information regarding them if we do decide to scope them in to 4.1.
14 Nov 2011 11:33 PM #83
@skirtle - I confused you with an Sencha employee, my bad!
I've tried to find an official date for the 4.1 release, but haven't found one? Where can I find such information?
15 Nov 2011 5:58 AM #84
15 Nov 2011 6:50 AM #85
I'm confident that Sencha will address the performance issues. The question is, will it happen soon enough to retain developer interest?
Don, I know you're all busting your tails to get this done, and get it done right. And getting it done right should be the priority. That said, if 3.4.0 is the baseline for performance improvements, I think that we're missing the mark.
2.3 was the gold standard for performance - things took a hit in 3.0, improved along the way to 3.4, but nothing has been as fast as the 2.x line.
15 Nov 2011 6:54 AM #86
Since your 3.4 timings were 3x slower than mine, I would have expected 10-12 seconds for 4.1, not 22. Just makes me wonder how we could be measuring the same things. Is the installation of Windows very old maybe or perhaps had lots of apps installed/removed? I've seen Windows get crazy in its old age... where "old age" is somewhere between 6-12 months.
Onto the 22 seconds mystery, that’s a good question but not a mystery. If you watch the CPU when EXTJS is doing its load, it’s driving the CPU hard. A CPU load of 70% or above is classed as being driven hard and at this point CPU performance profile starts curve off. Also the longer an app consumes CPU time for,the more context switching takes place, more and more OS processes backup behind what’s consuming the CPU time and the benchmark curves becomes ”far” less linier. You might argue from this that as long as an 4.x EXTJS app doesn’t take anymore than x seconds to load, then no one is likely to see this behaviour, however that’s out of the developers control and when the app gains size you will start to see the extended less linier load times. The only real solution for 4.x is to get it faster the 3.x and give devs a real usable performance window to play with.
I could see that spec as "high end" in some environments, but it was the lowest-end laptop you could get 6 months ago basically. We probably need to mine eBay for some even older machines.
Agreed - the relative performance of 3.4 vs 4 vs 4.1 is rather stable regardless of actual speed. Except with your mystery machine as noted above
With regards to hardware/os/sencha framework and what’s at fault. It can only be the 4.x framework which is causing the issue. Using the same browser on the same hardware, 3.4.0 vs 4.1 you see there is serious issue in 4.1
Again, thanks for all your help and input!
15 Nov 2011 7:01 AM #87
I'm confident that Sencha will address the performance issues.
Given what we've been hearing, I would say you are an incorrigible optimist... ;-) I think it's safe to say that 2.3 performance levels are a pipe dream at this point... Also, you seem to have misunderstood Don's position on performance baseline. (Either that or I have...) If I understood his post correctly, he considers 4.1 - not 3.4.0 - to be the performance baseline; hence, my concerns about "moving goalposts"...
15 Nov 2011 10:37 AM #88
The baseline simply serves as the point where a performance regression blocks the build process. Like a unit test failure. In a stabilization phase, the baseline is there to ensure we don't lose what we have gained in the previous optimization phases.
The "baseline" is also not necessarily the final word on "acceptance criteria" for 4.1. As I mentioned, that is TBD at this point.
15 Nov 2011 11:21 AM #89
15 Nov 2011 2:39 PM #90