Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Sencha User
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    11
    Vote Rating
    0
    alexn0816 is on a distinguished road

      0  

    Default ExtJS - no market penetration?

    ExtJS - no market penetration?


    I've been reviewing ExtJS for porting a pretty sophisticated web app from Flash/Flex to HTML5, and I definitely like what I see in ExtJS (component-centric, MVC framework, DOM-abstraction, etc), BUT there's something that's been gnawing at me and I'm hoping someone can enlighten me.

    I understand that some people might be turned off by the licensing and the learning curve, but I'm really surprised that there are so many developers preferring the JQuery+UIplugins route. I know it's not a very scientific survey, but when I go to monster.com, i get over 70 hits for 'JQuery' and just one lonely hit for 'ExtJS' (whose ad only mentions ExtJS along with a bunch of other frameworks).


    Why?

  2. #2
    Sencha User existdissolve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    522
    Vote Rating
    86
    existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice

      0  

    Default


    What kinds of projects are you searching for on Monster.com?

    Obviously, jQuery is more ubiquitous, but much of the reason for that is that it is targeted for a completely different domain. Have you ever tried developing a real JavaScript application using only jQuery? You quickly run into plugin hell, and your app becomes a pile of unmaintainable garbage. Of course, this is hyperbole, and there are very smart people that are able to make extremely sophisticated apps using this approach. However, I suspect alot of the "jobs" you are finding postings for are not full on web apps based on jQuery.

    So like I said before, look at the domain in which the solution is being leveraged. If you look in the intranet domain, you'll find lots of ExtJS being used by corporate customers that want really rich, cross-browser compatible web apps. On public websites, you'll find lots of jQuery +UI +plugins+whatever, partly because of the ubiquity of jQuery, partly because of the price (free), but also partly because using a full solution like ExtJS may not make the most sense.

    Ultimately, what's true of software in general is applicable here: popularity, while a factor, should not be a significant consideration. What SHOULD be a consideration is whether or not the product under consideration fits with what you need for your project/company/whatever. This, along with affordability, available skills, etc. should be what drives the decision making.

  3. #3
    Touch Premium Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    1,480
    Vote Rating
    216
    LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold LesJ is a splendid one to behold

      0  

    Default


    jQuery is typically used on simpler (small to medium size) applications and Ext JS usually is a better fit on more complex (medium to large size) applications. jQuery is more popular because there's simply more need for smaller and simpler apps.

    If you have a 'pretty sophisticated' Web application that you want to port from Flex, then Ext JS should be a solid platform.

  4. #4
    Sencha User
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    11
    Vote Rating
    0
    alexn0816 is on a distinguished road

      0  

    Default


    Yep, that's what I'm thinking. I guess by 'sophisticated' I meant that it's just a big app with lots of user ineractions for setting up graphs, charts, custom cell-rendering of datagrids for showing live data (via socket communication). I particularly like the fact that ExtJS is a 'full solution', and I don't have to go thru the pains of figuring out and maintaining a patchwork of plugins if i had gone with jquery.

  5. #5
    Sencha - Senior Forum Manager mitchellsimoens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts
    37,642
    Vote Rating
    899
    mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute

      0  

    Default


    You guys summed it up quite well. Comparing jQuery to Ext JS can be easy but it's really apples and oranges. There is nothing wrong with jQuery, it's a fine project for web sites but for web apps it doesn't seem to stand up to Ext JS in my opinion. It's about finding the right tool for the right job, don't need a sledgehammer to hammer a nail but you do for larger jobs.

    Plugin hell is an understatement but to be fair, Ext JS also has this issue. I for one have over 60 repos (extensions and example code) on GitHub many being for Ext JS and Sencha Touch but there are others that have some on GitHub or their websites. There isn't a popular package manager yet.
    Mitchell Simoens @SenchaMitch
    Sencha Inc, Senior Forum Manager
    ________________
    Check out my GitHub, lots of nice things for Ext JS 4 and Sencha Touch 2
    https://github.com/mitchellsimoens

    Think my support is good? Get more personalized support via a support subscription. https://www.sencha.com/store/

    Need more help with your app? Hire Sencha Services services@sencha.com

    Want to learn Sencha Touch 2? Check out Sencha Touch in Action that is in print!

    When posting code, please use BBCode's CODE tags.

  6. #6
    Sencha User
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26
    Vote Rating
    1
    andjarnic is on a distinguished road

      0  

    Default


    Interesting topic. I had heard of ext-js a couple years ago but jquery+plugins was by far the most dominant (and up until recently only) framework I've heard of the past few years. Prior to that prototype and YUI and GWT were pretty popular (GWT still is I think).

    I liken ext-js to Wicket.. both have steeper learning curves, but once learned, can provide more capable, faster, better quality (managed) applications.

    Let me ask you this though, and I wanted to post this as a general thread as well.. I am trying to understand if Ext-Js replaces (for the most part) the need to write any HTML code at all? I haven't barely scratched the surface yet, but I suspect that you basically build a desktop like application using nothing but ext-js, and it builds/renders the full app, html/css and all for all the browsers it supports.. is this correct? Thus, if it is, we basically need to be more or less good to advanced javascript developers to build on top of all the components that can be leveraged to build a web UI?

    I am putting up a thread with similar intent to this post because I am a little confused on how to really get started with ext-js because of my prior 10+ year background in web development using nothing like this.

  7. #7
    Sencha - Senior Forum Manager mitchellsimoens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Gainesville, FL
    Posts
    37,642
    Vote Rating
    899
    mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute mitchellsimoens has a reputation beyond repute

      0  

    Default


    Quote Originally Posted by andjarnic View Post
    Let me ask you this though, and I wanted to post this as a general thread as well.. I am trying to understand if Ext-Js replaces (for the most part) the need to write any HTML code at all? I haven't barely scratched the surface yet, but I suspect that you basically build a desktop like application using nothing but ext-js, and it builds/renders the full app, html/css and all for all the browsers it supports.. is this correct? Thus, if it is, we basically need to be more or less good to advanced javascript developers to build on top of all the components that can be leveraged to build a web UI?
    As a high level look yes, with Ext JS we don't want you to have to deal with the HTML. To do more advanced things, create custom components the need to tell Ext JS what to render may come up but it's not a progressive enhancement framework like jQuery primarily is. For CSS, we include all the CSS for the default components but if you need to create anything custom then we have SASS mixins what the like available to help you.
    Mitchell Simoens @SenchaMitch
    Sencha Inc, Senior Forum Manager
    ________________
    Check out my GitHub, lots of nice things for Ext JS 4 and Sencha Touch 2
    https://github.com/mitchellsimoens

    Think my support is good? Get more personalized support via a support subscription. https://www.sencha.com/store/

    Need more help with your app? Hire Sencha Services services@sencha.com

    Want to learn Sencha Touch 2? Check out Sencha Touch in Action that is in print!

    When posting code, please use BBCode's CODE tags.

  8. #8
    Sencha User existdissolve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    522
    Vote Rating
    86
    existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice existdissolve is just really nice

      1  

    Default


    Quote Originally Posted by mitchellsimoens View Post
    Plugin hell is an understatement but to be fair, Ext JS also has this issue. I for one have over 60 repos (extensions and example code) on GitHub many being for Ext JS and Sencha Touch but there are others that have some on GitHub or their websites. There isn't a popular package manager yet.
    Good point

  9. #9
    Sencha User
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    California
    Posts
    26
    Vote Rating
    1
    andjarnic is on a distinguished road

      0  

    Default


    Good info all. I do have a question.. what constitutes a web site vs a web app? In my career everything I've worked on has basically been what I always thought was a web app. It's essentially a desktop app done in the browser. In years past it wasn't quite as fancy as today's web apps, but basically you'd have users create accounts, log in, manage things, send forms, etc.

    So when you say jquery is more suited to web sites, what exactly does that mean and how does ext-js differ in what it produces? I am thinking with the various UI plugins, you can build a web app with jquery that functions just as well as an ext-js or a hand coded site. What draws me to ext-js, is the rich components it provides without the need to worry about the html/css and layout and cross browser issues. I am hoping once I learn it a bit more, I can more rapidly build nice fully functional desktop-like apps for the web, because while I know some html and css, I am far from knowledgeable enough to deal with all the intracacies that go along with the different browsers and platforms and versions of those browsers.