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jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 7:40 AM
Most of you are probably familiar with the commercial license thread that went on and ultimately the decision to stay open source - because that is what most of the community encouraged and it felt like the right thing to do. I don't regret that decision, but I must say - I am very disappointed.

After over 2 months of hard work, the new alpha release was made available to everyone and was downloaded over 2000 times. That's pretty amazing for an alpha release!

The part that was disappointing is that there were 0 donations. That's right, absolutely no donations. I understand it's just an alpha release, the documentation and examples are very low quality, and some people may be waiting for support/commercial licenses - but 0 donations?

I am working in 24+ hour shifts to fix the bugs you report, answer your questions and give support to those who need it.

I also created a new toolbar and menu example with code comments - it's not as good as documentation, but hopefully it's a start.

In case you are having trouble finding the donate button, here's a shortcut.

http://www.yui-ext.com/deploy/ext-1.0-alpha2/docs/welcome.html

The new build is available here:

http://www.yui-ext.com/deploy/ext-1.0-alpha2.zip

The menu example is here:

http://www.yui-ext.com/deploy/ext-1.0-alpha2/examples/menu/menus.html

Most notable bug fixes:
- Gray/vista theme now have gray menus
- fix date picker month menu not hiding on mouseout with aero theme
- fix strange rounding problem with paging toolbar
- borderlayout slide+expand = disappear corrected. It now pins (as requested) without the anim
- toolbar and menu cursor+gray text problem fixed
- random tree issues corrected
- RowSelectionModel getSelected/getSelections corrected

Edit
Technically there was one donation yesterday, but it was by someone who is not even using the alpha - he donated for help given in private messages.

mnugter
20 Feb 2007, 8:12 AM
I have every intention of donating to you, I just didn't get around to it. I promise I'll donate tonight :) I'll see what I can miss, just heard that I can buy a house so I am a little low on cash as well :) At minimum I'll donate 50 euro's, I look into it tonight to see if I can make it a 100.

The reason I didn't make my boss donate (yet) is because I want him to purchase the support license (I'll see if I can convince him to take the premium license). He said he will buy the license but wont donate in that case...

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 8:14 AM
Thank you! I will be around if you need any help.

lorenzo
20 Feb 2007, 8:35 AM
Hi Jack, I donated few minutes ago...

I really want to thank you for this great library. I hope I can contribute not only by money but even with some work on your project.

I wrote to rgraff giving my disposition to help for Italian translation of documentation. I hope I can help you in this project.

Thanks

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 8:36 AM
Thank you lorenzo! RGraff is usually around in the evening.

dj
20 Feb 2007, 8:37 AM
Hi Jack,

Thanks for that new demo - the menus are sweeet :)

I wanted to wait for the support contracts to get you some money - not really because i would need extra support besides this forum but because "support contract" looks better than "donation" in my accounting.

That said, i just donated a small amount that really doesn't hurt me but maybe makes you a little bit happier until the support contracts are set up.

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 8:40 AM
Thank you dj. I am working on more examples, documentation, bug fixes and the compat layer. bmoeskau is also helping with code documentation. His code documentation is GREAT (he authored the new Date docs!).

Bobafart
20 Feb 2007, 9:00 AM
I just bought a house, had a baby, I am not a web developer (I use Ext for fun, I don't create websites for business purposes) AND I just donated.

So if I can donate so can YOU!

Help Jack -- donate to keep Ext running strong...

(Jack with my donation can you build a "fisheye" menu script and post it in the examples section of the new website? purty please? )

SteveElbows
20 Feb 2007, 9:23 AM
Hello, Ive been lurking for ages, very impressed by 0.33 etc. After playing with 0.33 I decided to wait for th new version, because I saw your posts about how much has changed, so seemed easier to wait and just learn the new stuff than learn whats changed.

Now the alpha is out but I havent had time to do much with it yet. I always planned to donate when the time felt right, and will probably be using this stuff commercially in the future so expect to give you more funding via that side of things.

Since I was first amazed by your work, I prayed that you would not lose faith & energy, not be bought-off by some huge company and no longer have time to work on yui-ext, not go 100% commercial and closed source or anything like that. Only in the last few weeks did I see various posts from you that indicated these sorts of things are not just me being paranoid, but a possibility. If it happened it would be such a tragedy that the side of me that likes web development might die forever, so I always wanted to do my small part to stop this happening.

What has caught me offguard is the pace of all this, it did not even occur to me that you woulld expect the timing of donations to coincide with the release of the first alpha of version 1. I shall go and make a donation within the next few hours, not sure what state my paypal account is in. Please dont lose hope, after all 1.0 has not reached beta yet, the number of amazing examples and real world uses of ext is still in its infancy, you have not put 1.0 in your blog yet, and it sounds like all sorts of exciting future potential exists via the linkup with JQuery.

I think it takes balls to step out on your own and rely on donations and other future revenue streams to support you & your family. The pressures of money & time are one of the great hurdles that prevents many people breaking out and innovating on their own, it is understandable why people stay away from such risk. In my opinion you have already been bold, and laid foundations which are potentially very important for a stable future. But it will take some time for this to get to a level you need for it to sustain you fully. Those who already along for the ride need to try to mke sure we fill this gap in the meantime, so I dont think you should suffer in silence. But it maybe that in the future the donations on their own are not sustainable, and that the commercial options will be your main revenue and 'subsidize' the opensource side of things more than donations will. If you didnt already suspect that donations on their own arent enough, would you have even started talking about the commercial stuff?

My opinion is that the time for people to go out and evangelize ext and spread word of it to the masses, and thus have a much larger pool of potential donors, is when 1.0 is pretty much finished and released, or at last when the docs and examples are all fully updated. Only then will it become clear just how much of your target earnings are actually achievable via donations.

Please dont give up or start to burnout or panic. Oh I dont mean to lecture you, youve created something magical, and I am just hyper-sensitive about this getting derailed at all by disappointment on either side. Anyway I shutup now and go and sort out a donation, I plan to donate again once 1.0 is nearer completion, I hope it goes towards a nice rest & holiday for you and your family becausse you seem to be a coding machine with an impressive workrate, the least you deserve is some quality time off once some milestone has been reached. Unless you are addicted to this as the users are, thinking about donating is hard when a new release emerges and there is much exciting code to look at :)

Cheers

Steve from the UK, hoping for a long and fruitful relationship which involves much cash in exchange for wonderful work.

trevport
20 Feb 2007, 9:24 AM
I'm using yui-ext in a project at work and it has without a doubt saved my weeks of development time. Thus, I have been planning on making a personal donation for some time now but just never got around to it yet (I will tonight I promise). More importantly, I am going to start petitioning the powers above at my company to make a donation as it is playing an ever larger role in our web development. I hope others will also come forward and start rewarding you as well for this amazing toolkit.

Webnet
20 Feb 2007, 9:32 AM
Donation on behalf of me/PuritysDisciple sent!

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 9:43 AM
Thank you guys. I hope you know I do appreciate it.

Steve, I have every intention of being patient and seeing this through. There are many exciting things developing and I would also like to assure you, that once the decision was made for Ext to remain open source - that is a decision that will stick.

To be honest, I didn't expect a flood of donations - my expectations were very low. I was surprised when 0 came in though. If you haven't noticed, I never hesitate to discuss things with everyone - everything out in the open. That's just me. ;)

thejoker101
20 Feb 2007, 9:47 AM
FWIW, I was waiting to get one of the support options as opposed to donating. Is there a way to do that now? Or are we still waiting for that? I presume other people besides myself were thinking the same thing.

SteveElbows
20 Feb 2007, 9:58 AM
Thanks for the reassurance Jack, I hope you never take any lack of faith, or fear on my part, personally. I am just one of those silly humans who fears the worst as some sort of mind insurance, so that if the worst ever did happen then it wouldnt be a total shock to me.

Anyway I love it that you discuss things openly, and I have now made that donation. I would pledge to give you a dollar for every word I type on the forums, but as it seems I talk too much once I get going, that might be a bit over the top :p

Was the 0 donations on release day feeling in anyway comparable to the anticlimax that can sometimes accompany software/upgrade launches in general? Im sure there are many stories of great releases of software, but in my small company dayjob, I usually only get to talk much to people about problems, and features that are needed, once stuff is done and released, I get precious little feedback. Hopefully you wont suffer this much because there is such a nice wow factor to user interface stuff done right, I cant wait for the day that our system switches to using your stuff for the UI. I shouldnt set myself up for a fall by expecting too much feedback from users, but if they dont get excited by this stuff then what will?

Anyway thanks again for all youve shared so far, I shall now try and stop my enthusiam from translating into waffle on these forums (Im possibly overexcited for finally talking here after dribbling over ext for months), and go and look at the alpha properly, mmmm nice menu examples :)

Webnet
20 Feb 2007, 9:59 AM
Just donate, jack needs the money to support his pregnant wife and child. it's not like he has a company paying him salary to work on this, think about the donations he needs consistantly to have somewhat of financial security. If you appreciate his hard work and this library, express that to him and donate.

Every little bit helps even if it's just $5-10!


.... I had to change my pants after I saw that menu demo ......

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 10:13 AM
Steve, yes after the release there definitely is a bit of an anticlimax. Maybe that's what made me so sensitive to the 0 donations. There's is still so much to do though, and I am still very excited (in particular very excited about the jQuery compatibility).

The future looks very bright, and newly formed Ext Team (yes, we are building a team!) will improve the quality of the library, improve documentation, improve the professional look of Ext and hopefully this will help to improve the financial state of the project.

Thank you for taking the time to respond, and thank you for donating.

mnugter
20 Feb 2007, 11:10 AM
Well, everything I earned today is now heading your way!

asalgo
20 Feb 2007, 12:11 PM
Hi Jack

I definitely want to pay you soon.

I got a meeting with my boss tomorrow and I will force him to buy a license. I am just waiting on the support options since it is easier with an proper invoice as opposed to donating.

San
20 Feb 2007, 12:25 PM
You have at least 1. I sent along a donation on Feb 14th to encourage the 1.0 release.

Let's get a support license rolling for you. It's funny, but just having one sheet look like an official bill makes it easier for companies to pay you.

Anyone have a sample vendor support Bill from another comperable product/company for Jack?

mdissel
20 Feb 2007, 12:55 PM
Most of you are probably familiar with the commercial license thread that went on and ultimately the decision to stay open source - because that is what most of the community encouraged and it felt like the right thing to do. I don't regret that decision, but I must say - I am very disappointed.


I was waiting for the official commercial license and i think more people did ..

Any idea when you start with the commercial license (and switch back to svn-based updates (for licensed users)?

Thanks for all your efforts!

Marco

reignman
20 Feb 2007, 1:42 PM
you're the best so thats why everybody should donate ;)

even a poor student :)

yogurtearl
20 Feb 2007, 1:55 PM
I suggest Google adsense.
It costs nothing to setup.

Would anyone here be bothered by ads?
I would click them.

Michael

lumar
20 Feb 2007, 2:08 PM
Jack I tried the new paypal widget and it worked like a charm :wink: . Hopefully this widget will be a big hit :D

All I have to say is that there are a plethora of javascript libraries out there (esp., open source) and NOT ONE can compare with Ext--both in quality and look n feel. I know that the documentation and examples are weak now but I have good faith in the commuinty to help with this awesome effort and help not just with complaints and bugs but with donations and contributions.


Luis Marrero
Member of the technical staff
Motorola, Inc
[email protected]

Herm
20 Feb 2007, 3:18 PM
Thanks for the reminder to us all Jack; I've made another monetary contribution and am waiting on the chat transcript to see where I can contribute hands on.

By the way Exters, in PayPal screens and emails and on your bank's statements, the word "donation" is NEVER mentioned. It says "PAYPAL *JACKSLOCUM".

Cheers,
Peter

Ian
20 Feb 2007, 5:42 PM
I threw some $$ in this evening, I'll double-up again once you're out of beta. ;)

Great work Jack, reallly impressive stuff.

vajra
20 Feb 2007, 6:41 PM
Hi Jack, You are absolutely just in asking for donations. I just donated personally and I think I should be able to get some more money to you by this Friday. I promise to support you as much as possible, at least a donation once a month for $5.

Also, I wrote to rgraff yesterday about assisting in documentation, but I have not heard back. I hope I can assist by donating some of my time as well.

THIS IS A CALL TO ACTION FOR EVERYONE WHO HAS DOWNLOADED EXT 1.0. PLEASE DONATE AT LEAST $5 USD TO JACK SO HE CAN CONTINUE HIS FANTASTIC WORK. IF WE ALL CONTRIBUTE TO THIS PROJECT ON A MONTHLY BASIS, THERE IS NO LIMIT TO WHAT EXT WILL BE IN THE FUTURE.

Please respond in this thread after you have donated so you can motivate others to follow....

Sincerely,

Vajra

jack.slocum
20 Feb 2007, 10:47 PM
Sorry everyone I had to get some sleep. :) Thank you for your support. I appreciate it very much!

xsokev
21 Feb 2007, 9:23 AM
I just donated. Sorry I hadn't sooner.

I have worked Ext into the application at my company and I am working on getting them to donate a more sizable amount. Just have to get through all the RED tape.

Thanks again for the great work!

jratcliff
21 Feb 2007, 9:15 PM
Hi Jack,

I just donated a little of my own money and once you make the commercial license available I'll have my company purchase an enterprise license.

Jack

zquirm
21 Feb 2007, 11:46 PM
just added a donation...not much...but more to come...I assure you.

when you have a chance to discuss the email I sent you, I'd love to have your input. I just secured several big investors in New York for my startup and I'd like to help Ext grow.

thanks for everything!

maerteijn
22 Feb 2007, 1:10 AM
Hello Jack.

First of all : It's amazing to see what you've achieved already with your libraries. The widgets and effects look beautiful and above all : Technical it's so clean and nice implemented that it's a real pleasure to program with it.

Anyway, I wanted to donate some money but for some silly reason Paypal says the following :

You have accessed your account from a sanctioned country. Per international sanctions regulations, you are not authorized to access the PayPal system.

Well, I didn't know The Netherlands is so dangerous that it should be sanctioned. Anyway, is there some other way to donate, like a bank account or something?

jack.slocum
22 Feb 2007, 1:15 AM
Thanks again everyone.

maerteijn, that's the first time I have ever seen that. The whole point of PayPal is it should be able to process international! I will look into it and see what I can find out. Thanks for letting me know.

brian.moeskau
22 Feb 2007, 1:20 AM
I know for a fact that PayPal does not accept payment from some countries, although I never would have guessed that the Netherlands was a problem. But I've seen in other forums that people, especially from some countires in Eastern Europe and Asia, are not able to use PayPal for various reasons (fraud, gov't regulations, etc.)

thameema
22 Feb 2007, 2:32 AM
Hi Jack,

I am impressed with your great work. I have been start using this library in conjuction with YUI library for the past one month and I donated $25 after downloaded the 0.40 version two weeks ago. Keep up your good work.

alanwilliamson
22 Feb 2007, 4:02 AM
Jack, I appreciate all your hard work.

However, you have to figure out what you want from life. If you are going to rely on donations to earn a living then isn't going to go anywhere. You need to figure out how to make income from this project so you can spend it developing new features.

You do not want to have to create another thread plee like this, because it does nothing to inspire confidence to your users and it only makes you look annoyed and angry. Not the Happy Jack we've all come to know and love.

For my own part, I emailed you a number of weeks ago and asked that you help me with a simple problem, and I offered you $100 if memory serves me right. The problem in question was simply getting one of your examples to work a little differently and I was happy for the change to go back to the community. Yet after a couple of exchanges, I heard nothing.

I am in a position now where again, I need something to work that isn't, and it would be cheaper for me to slip one of you guys $100-$200 to get it fixed as you know the code like the back of your hand than it would be for me to go wading through it.

So while I understand your position Jack, one can only give you so much sympathy. You need to figure out how you want to make money. Support contracts I would recommend to be the best way at this moment in time, since there are people out there willing and ready to take them out with you. Renewable income every month, food on the table, life could be good! :)

I am a person ready to give you guys money, I need to know that this project is going to be around and that I can call on someone for support when I need it, not when someone decides to answer a forum post.

Make it happen

brian.moeskau
22 Feb 2007, 4:16 AM
While I can't speak for Jack, I can tell you that there are plans being formulated for moving beyond the donation-only phase. However, those are still in the works and will take a bit of time to execute properly, as you can imagine. I think this thread was more about getting some funds to keep things moving along until then, and also hoping people would show their support for all the work that's obviously been going on for the past 2 months (many people have).

Regarding your specific needs, have you posted your issue to the forums? If so, did you offer it up as a for-$ proposition? You may be able to get someone aside from Jack who can help you if Jack doesn't have time. Please be patient, as it is currently a transitional time for Jack and the small (but growing) team as we try to get the project moving forward to the next level. Ext will definitely be around for a long time to come, and the support options should start to improve soon as the 1.0 release settles down.

mnugter
22 Feb 2007, 4:51 AM
I know for a fact that PayPal does not accept payment from some countries, although I never would have guessed that the Netherlands was a problem. But I've seen in other forums that people, especially from some countires in Eastern Europe and Asia, are not able to use PayPal for various reasons (fraud, gov't regulations, etc.)

It seems that paypal just doesn't like you :wink: I'm from the Netherlands too and donated without problem.

wq7278
22 Feb 2007, 8:30 AM
Hi Jack,
Keep going. I promise I will donate after I use the 1.0 version in my App, or I will persuade my boss buy the support license. I am checking your stuff everyday. they are so cool.

Choleriker
7 Mar 2007, 10:20 PM
Interesting ... since weeks i try to get contact to you jack. My customer completely understand that we have to pay for your great week. He needs it very professional. But he want support like you have described on the other post related to commercial licences planned for 1.0, where we can get updates and email-support for one year.

I have spoken with him and we are waiting for your answer. I can send my request again, just let me know how to contact you or which is a working email. My Email is [email protected]

At the end of this week at last at the middle of next week we want to start. The small application is mostly finished and all problems until now are fixed with the 1.0 alpha. Please let me know what you think.

At last: i have tried many many sh.. ajax frameworks and i dont want to support another as yui-ext! My customer really likes yui-ext too. Stay tuned!

jack.slocum
7 Mar 2007, 10:24 PM
Please send me an email to [email protected] or you can PM me with any questions.

Choleriker
7 Mar 2007, 10:28 PM
Please send me an email to [email protected] or you can PM me with any questions.

Thank you, you will get a message soon!

neongrau
8 Mar 2007, 6:34 AM
hi jack!


i showed this thread to my boss and he made donation via paypal. (look for TQsoft / Germany) :wink:

thanks for your great work, keep it up!

it's amazing to see all those great new features in the upcoming 1.0 :D

jack.slocum
8 Mar 2007, 6:39 AM
Thank you for the support neongrau. It's very much appreciated! (tell your boss too) ;)

SteveEisner
8 Mar 2007, 5:06 PM
Jack, I've also sent you a mail regarding commercial licenses... My client's concerns are similar to alanwilliamson's (previous page.) I'd love to help you get their business, because it's a total win-win situation!

fsuguinness
9 Mar 2007, 8:35 AM
Hey Jack,

I dontated a little bit ago. I hope it helps. I will be definitely donating more in the future. I would not want to ever think about making a webpage without the help of your library. Keep up the good work.

-fsuguinness

willgillen
9 Mar 2007, 12:56 PM
I just dontated. I just couldn't bear to use such a great set of libraries in my projects without giving something back to you for all of your hard work!

Thank you Jack!

-- Will Gillen

jack.slocum
9 Mar 2007, 2:21 PM
Thanks guys. Now make some Ext-ellent apps! :)

tof
16 Mar 2007, 5:29 AM
Jack,
I donated (for yui-ext, not Ext 1.0) on 13/02. Of course I assume it does count for Ext 1.0 too ? :)

Note, I earn money with the apps developped with Ext - so I will donate for each finished app, most probably !

Thanks a lot, Ext is becoming a real developpement framework.

jweber
16 Mar 2007, 9:18 AM
Jack,

It might help to update your blog. The one at http://www.jackslocum.com/blog/ hasn't been updated in a couple months, and there's no mention of the 1.0 alpha. That's the page I had bookmarked, and I wouldn't have known about the alpha if I hadn't seen it mentioned on other sites.

Jacob

benkooijman
17 Mar 2007, 12:57 PM
I'm not using Ext (any version), privately or commercially (I may in the far future. Perhaps. Possibly. Um, unlikely actually. Never mind...), but since this is the only Javascript library out there which is extensive, consistent and elegant and where the code has good levels of quality, it deserves to live on and grow.

I just donated $100; take it it to the max, Jack :)

Ben.

brian.moeskau
17 Mar 2007, 4:45 PM
Jack,

It might help to update your blog. The one at http://www.jackslocum.com/blog/ hasn't been updated in a couple months, and there's no mention of the 1.0 alpha. That's the page I had bookmarked, and I wouldn't have known about the alpha if I hadn't seen it mentioned on other sites.

Jacob
In case you hadn't noticed, Jack's been busy coding :) He's well aware of the blog post shortage, and plans to get back into posting once 1.0 is out. As you know based on all his previous posts, they are usually quite in-depth (i.e., time-consuming) and all effort has been focused on the code lately.

JasonMichael
17 Mar 2007, 9:09 PM
Jack, just want to thank you for this open source opportunity... I donated some today. I'm planning to use this for all my clients, and will donate more, as they eventually pay me for my work. I'm *very* new to all of this and Javascript, but the benefit is so great, I've actually delayed two of my client's projects probably 2 months over the time they would have wanted.... and so far, one of them has happily waited as I showed some progress... the other, I'll probably lose, but ooh well... his loss 'cause he couldn't wait just a bit longer for me to gethim something absolutely awesome using your library.

I promise to donate a nice percentage for every job I get! I just hope I can stay in business, but I think if I master this library, I'll have no problem... have to get this on my website for advertising!

I suggest all you pros do the same - don't just donate once, but for each project give Jack a donation... every little bit helps I'm sure.

dfenwick
17 Mar 2007, 11:10 PM
For those of us that previously donated, I'm assuming this isn't directed at us. :D

bazzz
18 Mar 2007, 3:26 PM
Jack,

I haven't been using your library and probably won't to do so in the future (I'm developing Java JMS-based backend code, the nasty EAI stuff).

I just donated some bucks (it won't hurt me) just because I think that this is one of the coolest projects around.

Keep up the good work!

Axel

bazzz
18 Mar 2007, 3:53 PM
I'm not using Ext (any version), privately or commercially (I may in the far future. Perhaps. Possibly. Um, unlikely actually. Never mind...), but since this is the only Javascript library out there which is extensive, consistent and elegant and where the code has good levels of quality, it deserves to live on and grow.

I just donated $100; take it it to the max, Jack :)

Ben.

Although my donation was smaller I seem to be in the same position as you are.

Someday we might be forced to used applications based on js-libraries and then they better be good :-)

(just a hint from someone who is forced to use the fuc**** Siebel ActiveX-contaminated web interface to validate his backend code).

Rgds,

Axel

salvi
18 Mar 2007, 4:04 PM
Hello Jack!

I want to say that you work is very useful for us all and I think we should donate to you. I don't know how it works in other countries but in Poland in such cases it is better to pay for the license instead of making a simple donation. Because I run my own small business I need to have an invoice from you for such payment. Is it possible that you could send the invoice?

brian.moeskau
18 Mar 2007, 4:30 PM
Hi Salvi,

We're still working on the methods for accepting license and support payments, which probably won't be available until close to the official 1.0 release. At that time, sending invoices will not be a problem.

Brian

alien3d
19 Mar 2007, 12:11 AM
mysql have make support based license fee.Like me and other ,i think they would pay for fast support.like me just know php based application and a few bit code in javascript.Fast support would very helpfull.
**Have try Ext 1.0 and yui-ext 0.33.Maybe you can host my beta php inventory pplication using ext 1.0.
** More faster then asp application

salvi
19 Mar 2007, 3:14 AM
Hello Bmoeskau!

Please let us know when you'll be ready to send invoices. Post info on forum and maybe send us info with newsletter. Thanks a lot!

19 Mar 2007, 5:45 AM
Jack,

I donated much more than I pay for software (look for liquid_ice_ at hotmail dot com). I feel for you - giving up your job to work on this project. You have more guts than I , that's for sure.

To you other folks just thinking about using this software w/out donating, you really should pony up some $. Jack has spent countless hours busting his hump to make things easier. His documentation is absolutely well done, and a great reference for when you forget things. Not to mention, he has a plethora of examples from which you can learn from.


I felt compelled to donate as much as I could because we're a small company. We're using your image picker in a modified way here: http://bebekisses.com/storchenwiege-wrap-pr-6.html
(Click on Preview).

So get off your asses and donate!

jack.slocum
19 Mar 2007, 6:30 AM
Thank you guys (and gals), I really appreciate it.

djliquidice, that preview looks good. I like your theme as well. Nice and clean!

19 Mar 2007, 10:52 AM
Thank you guys (and gals), I really appreciate it.

djliquidice, that preview looks good. I like your theme as well. Nice and clean!

Thanks dude. I learn from the best ;)