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Thread: Is Sencha ******** single developers?

  1. #471
    Sencha Premium Member
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    Default

    You are mixing up licensing and pricing

  2. #472
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by joeri View Post
    What I meant is that if it were true that there is no reasonable alternative to Sencha, then they can charge what it would cost to build your own solution matching the unique sencha capabilities. My experience building similar components (e.g. I wrote my own JavaScript grid component pre-sencha) is that this quickly explodes into costs of tens of thousands of euros of developer hours. Therefore, if it were true that they are uniquely capable as a framework, they could charge tens of thousands of euros.
    That is a good point. If someone were to commission you to build an application without using Ext JS vs an application using Ext JS, which would have the better ROI? Ext JS has a ton of functionality and the theming is very easy. Versus piecing together micro-libraries and styling them to be cohesive and then also developing the functionality gaps the app would need could cost more than if a single dev were to buy the 5 pack. This is dependent on the app requirements of course but for the apps Sencha is wanting created with Ext JS that means a certain sophistication of that app.

  3. #473
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    Default They need single developer license even for large companies

    Even in large organizations, projects are often small and moneys are committed on a project-by-project basis. Sharing licenses and costs across projects is not often that simple. We have purchased a 5 developer license for many years now, but on other projects I have purchased two or three single developer licenses (as we added developers) and I might not have been able to persuade the other project to use Sencha if the up front cost had been so high. If Sencha sees a problem, seems like a better approach would be to gradually increase the cost of the single developer license to the point where many involved would decide it was simply easier to buy the 5 developer pack.

  4. #474
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    Deciding to switch to a drastic licensing approach is not that bad in my case as there is a long time i can't decide to use only extjs or dhtmlx. Now, this confirms once again sencha is playing with developers with drastic changes from time to time .I were not able to make a final decision about that but sencha is able to and decided for me by telling me to go the dhtmlx way so i do

    Thanks for all !

  5. #475
    Sencha User berlamont's Avatar
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    Exclamation Not True

    ExtJs is great and all, but it has plenty of competition. There are definitely alternatives, and most of them offer even more than Ext at a lower cost! I already listed some in a previous post, but it's dead simple to find alternatives.

    I'm finishing out the last project I have for a client who bought a license a while ago, and I'm done. I'll probably go with one of the .NET suites (componentone,infragistics,devexpress), but I really wish they will come up with a new pricing model. Any client would think I was crazy if I told them that they would have to get a minimum of 5 dev licenses, when most of them don't have/need a full time dev!

    Quote Originally Posted by mysticav View Post
    Hi,

    I'm pretty sure that a lot of ExtJS/Touch users, as soon as they knew about the price increase, out of curiosity or necessity, immediately started to look at alternatives.

    Unfortunately no framework is even close to ExtJS.

    I have some experience with AngularJS + jQuery + Bootstrap 3, and although you can end up with a very good looking app, you also might end up with 30+ third party plugins/widgets from different sources, which is not terribly hard to manage using tools like Bower, Grunt, etc. but it becomes a pain in the ass to integrate a full OOP and MVC application, let alone building the app for production env. (concatenating, minifying, etc), theming each widget so they look as part of an integrated app, dealing with limited grid functionality, take for instance the "ng-grid" (Angular Grid), which is still in beta and ridiculously so far behind ExtJS Grid, which is definitely the best in the market. And list goes on...

    That is why this whole situation is terribly sad. Sencha has taken a decision that not only affects freelancers economy and career, but also their dignity. Some good guys have dedicated part of their lives helping people in Sencha forums, most of them freelancers. And how are they getting paid? Many have been recommending Sencha to their customers year after year, and in return they get a 300% increase. Wonderful.

    I hope somebody starts a blog dedicated to ex-ExtJS developers sharing tips about how to integrate open-source technology (like AngularJS) following the good practices already learnt from ExtJS.

    Probably a good idea would be to start a new framework based on all those great jQuery+bootstrap-angularJS widgets. That is, combining the best of the open source libraries into a single and consistent toolkit.

    I got an ExtJS 5 one developer license (no support) a few months ago, for 329 USD. I wonder if this license is still valid, will see.

    I recommend this article:
    http://www.sagivfrankel.com/2013/10/...my-experience/

  6. #476
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    I think its sort of funny that people are complaining about the requirement to buy a 5 developer license (and yes, Sencha is so STOOPID.. they should have just said you can buy a single user license for $5K.), However, while I hear people talk about other component sets, for me, what makes Sencha valuable is that I can build an app for a customer in a fraction of the time compared to any other tool I have found. The ability to build a CRUD system in hours, not days without writing a line of HTML, the fast, robust database access, will keep me as a customer. One of my customers contracted with me to build an "interesting" inventory, order entry system". I will end up billing him CLOSE to 6 figures for this. He is paying a premium price, but when he calls me @ 3PM and asks for serious revisions to the system, I can deliver them before end of business that day. If someone has another product that will let me do that, then I am all ears.p.s. I wonder if @ SENCHACONN if they will make us walk through metal detectors and remove any sharp objects before talking to any sales people?Bruce

  7. #477
    Ext JS Premium Member
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    Default

    Yes, I think we all agree that Sencha has a great framework, with an awesome set of components, but let's not forget how they got here.
    I think that single developers and hobbyist pushed Sencha forward , so in my opinion you are so wrong not seeing the big picture and not having a perspective thinking.

    Regards,
    Danny

  8. #478
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    I agree with you that Sencha is making a HUGE mistake with:1) Drastic increase of price with NO prior heads up2) Hiding and not answering questions3) Coming up with a "new" industry standard of 5 license minimum (There are a lot of expensive tools in the world, but I have not found anyone else who says you need to buy 5 licenses for 1 user!However, when I see a comment like Berlamont (and no, I am not picking on him, many others have echoed the same): "ExtJs is great and all, but it has plenty of competition. There are definitely alternatives, and most of them offer even more than Ext at a lower cost! I already listed some in a previous post, but it's dead simple to find alternatives."I would LOVE to see a tool that offers MORE than Sencha. I have not found one that is even close yet. (Assuming I don't want to write a lot of HTML and need robust database access)

  9. #479
    Sencha User nomack84's Avatar
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    Default

    I'm agree with @blomasky. In this post, when someone says something that is true about ExtJS, as he says in his previous post, then people marks the answer as negative. This is wrong. This post shouldn't be against the quality of ExtJS as a framework. ExtJS is great, is amazing. Whoever says something different is crazy or doesn't know what is talking about.
    This post should discuss about the silence of the Sencha enterprise about the price chance and this crazy police of 5 developers.
    I've been working and loving ExtJS for +5 years. Whenever I have a chance I mention it to everyone, because to me, ExtJS is the best JS frameworks around, for RIA, of course, because jQuery is... well. There are alternatives, it's true, but none of the are better than ExtJS.

    @blomasky What you mention about the pricing perhaps is true, but I'm sure you are from USA. There 3225 USD is not that much as in Ecuador, where I'm currently living. Here is a big amount of money. Having to buy 5 licences for one developers here is not an option. Also, is really hard to sell a software here for 6 digits...
    Ext is terrific!!

  10. #480
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    Default end of thinking about sencha

    Quote Originally Posted by nicklaros View Post
    can't believe my eyes either.. well looks like it is a forever goodbye then...
    to be a solo developer sencha bumps you out why to a single developer license -- lets go to angularjs

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